Get a loan in bitcoin: How it works + Pros and cons l ...
3 Best Bitcoin Loan Programs (2020 Updated)
Bitcoin Loans Get a BTC Backed Credit on CoinLoan
7 Best Bitcoin Loan Programs (2020 Updated) - CoinDiligent
The Creditcoin Network is a blockchain that provides a cryptocurrency (e.g., Bitcoin, Ethereum, or ERC20) credit investment market. Investors and fundraisers can announce their offers, get matched, and record their loan transactions on the network. Further, investors can transfer their bond to another user. We bring the concept of credit to the cryptocurrency ecosystem.
Blockchain-based platform for Global Distributed Supply Chain Finance & Trade Services
AXenS is a secure and curated digital market place to provide both liquidity and efficiency to the import-export supply chain. It is a place that is trade-focused from the ground-up and that is secure not only by cutting-edge cryptography but also by customizable trust models, which make it possible to guarantee both the data privacy and auditability required by the many players in the industry.
10-19 14:06 - 'Nice. You should consider credit loans too. Interest rates are so low right now. Take advantage of this and stack more sats! Bitcoin will be 50k 1 year after the halving.' by /u/RedPill43 removed from /r/Bitcoin within 6-16min
06-02 10:23 - 'we are affiliated to banks of America and we work with the united states credit bureau we give out loans on a clear and understandable terms and conditions at an interest rate of 7% from as little as $1000 to $10,000,000...' by /u/americanloans removed from /r/Bitcoin within 79-89min
Would it be possible to pay off Student loan debt with credit cards through bitcoin and declare bankruptcy to vacate Student Loan debt?
Student loan debt is not forgiven during bankruptcy. However, credit card debt is. Would it be possible to take out a bunch of credit cards, buy a bunch of bitcoin with the cards, sell it, and then use the funds from the sold bitcoin to pay off student loans? Essentially, transfer the debt from Student loans to credit cards using bitcoin as an intermediary and once all of your debt is transferred to credit cards declare bankruptcy to get the debt forgiven. Is this doable?
Are there any companies or ideas for a company for there to be loans and credit for bitcoin? Once all of the centralized banks disappear people will still need loans for houses..cars etc. So has anyone else thought the same thing? There will have to be a brick and mortar for bitcoin loans..right?
I know this sounds like a dumb idea, but I’m going ahead regardless. I’ve been in the community since 2017 and I’ve been DCA for a while... I want a significantly larger position though. Any place I can get a personal loan of $50k to $100k that lets me put that on crypto?
Putting $400M of Bitcoin on your company balance sheet
Also posted on my blog as usual. Read it there if you can, there are footnotes and inlined plots. A couple of months ago, MicroStrategy (MSTR) had a spare $400M of cash which it decided to shift to Bitcoin (BTC). Today we'll discuss in excrutiating detail why this is not a good idea. When a company has a pile of spare money it doesn't know what to do with, it'll normally do buybacks or start paying dividends. That gives the money back to the shareholders, and from an economic perspective the money can get better invested in other more promising companies. If you have a huge pile of of cash, you probably should be doing other things than leave it in a bank account to gather dust. However, this statement from MicroStrategy CEO Michael Saylor exists to make it clear he's buying into BTC for all the wrong reasons:
“This is not a speculation, nor is it a hedge. This was a deliberate corporate strategy to adopt a bitcoin standard.”
Let's unpack it and jump into the economics Bitcoin:
Is Bitcoin money?
No. Or rather BTC doesn't act as money and there's no serious future path for BTC to become a form of money. Let's go back to basics. There are 3 main economic problems money solves: 1. Medium of Exchange. Before money we had to barter, which led to the double coincidence of wants problem. When everyone accepts the same money you can buy something from someone even if they don't like the stuff you own. As a medium of exchange, BTC is not good. There are significant transaction fees and transaction waiting times built-in to BTC and these worsen the more popular BTC get. You can test BTC's usefulness as a medium of exchange for yourself right now: try to order a pizza or to buy a random item with BTC. How many additional hurdles do you have to go through? How many fewer options do you have than if you used a regular currency? How much overhead (time, fees) is there? 2. Unit of Account. A unit of account is what you compare the value of objects against. We denominate BTC in terms of how many USD they're worth, so BTC is a unit of account presently. We can say it's because of lack of adoption, but really it's also because the market value of BTC is so volatile. If I buy a $1000 table today or in 2017, it's roughly a $1000 table. We can't say that a 0.4BTC table was a 0.4BTC table in 2017. We'll expand on this in the next point: 3. Store of Value. When you create economic value, you don't want to be forced to use up the value you created right away. For instance, if I fix your washing machine and you pay me in avocados, I'd be annoyed. I'd have to consume my payment before it becomes brown, squishy and disgusting. Avocado fruit is not good money because avocadoes loses value very fast. On the other hand, well-run currencies like the USD, GBP, CAD, EUR, etc. all lose their value at a low and most importantly fairly predictible rate. Let's look at the chart of the USD against BTC While the dollar loses value at a predictible rate, BTC is all over the place, which is bad. One important use money is to write loan contracts. Loans are great. They let people spend now against their future potential earnings, so they can buy houses or start businesses without first saving up for a decade. Loans are good for the economy. If you want to sign something that says "I owe you this much for that much time" then you need to be able to roughly predict the value of the debt in at the point in time where it's due. Otherwise you'll have a hard time pricing the risk of the loan effectively. This means that you need to charge higher interests. The risk of making a loan in BTC needs to be priced into the interest of a BTC-denominated loan, which means much higher interest rates. High interests on loans are bad, because buying houses and starting businesses are good things.
BTC has a fixed supply, so these problems are built in
Some people think that going back to a standard where our money was denominated by a stock of gold (the Gold Standard) would solve economic problems. This is nonsense. Having control over supply of your currency is a good thing, as long as it's well run. See here Remember that what is desirable is low variance in the value, not the value itself. When there are wild fluctuations in value, it's hard for money to do its job well. Since the 1970s, the USD has been a fiat money with no intrinsic value. This means we control the supply of money. Let's look at a classic poorly drawn econ101 graph The market price for USD is where supply meets demand. The problem with a currency based on an item whose supply is fixed is that the price will necessarily fluctuate in response to changes in demand. Imagine, if you will, that a pandemic strikes and that the demand for currency takes a sharp drop. The US imports less, people don't buy anything anymore, etc. If you can't print money, you get deflation, which is worsens everything. On the other hand, if you can make the money printers go brrrr you can stabilize the price Having your currency be based on a fixed supply isn't just bad because in/deflation is hard to control. It's also a national security risk... The story of the guy who crashed gold prices in North Africa In the 1200s, Mansa Munsa, the emperor of the Mali, was rich and a devout Muslim and wanted everyone to know it. So he embarked on a pilgrimage to make it rain all the way to Mecca. He in fact made it rain so hard he increased the overall supply of gold and unintentionally crashed gold prices in Cairo by 20%, wreaking an economic havoc in North Africa that lasted a decade. This story is fun, the larger point that having your inflation be at the mercy of foreign nations is an undesirable attribute in any currency. The US likes to call some countries currency manipulators, but this problem would be serious under a gold standard.
Currencies are based on trust
Since the USD is based on nothing except the US government's word, how can we trust USD not to be mismanaged? The answer is that you can probably trust the fed until political stooges get put in place. Currently, the US's central bank managing the USD, the Federal Reserve (the Fed for friends & family), has administrative authority. The fed can say "no" to dumb requests from the president. People who have no idea what the fed does like to chant "audit the fed", but the fed is already one of the best audited US federal entities. The transcripts of all their meetings are out in the open. As is their balance sheet, what they plan to do and why. If the US should audit anything it's the Department of Defense which operates without any accounting at all. It's easy to see when a central bank will go rogue: it's when political yes-men are elected to the board. For example, before printing themselves into hyperinflation, the Venezuelan president appointed a sociologist who publicly stated “Inflation does not exist in real life” and instead is a made up capitalist lie. Note what happened mere months after his gaining control over the Venezuelan currency This is a key policy. One paper I really like, Sargent (1984) "The end of 4 big inflations" states:
The essential measures that ended hyperinflation in each of Germany,Austria, Hungary, and Poland were, first, the creation of an independentcentral bank that was legally committed to refuse the government'sdemand or additional unsecured credit and, second, a simultaneousalteration in the fiscal policy regime.
In english: *hyperinflation stops when the central bank can say "no" to the government." The US Fed, like other well good central banks, is run by a bunch of nerds. When it prints money, even as aggressively as it has it does so for good reasons. You can see why they started printing on March 15th as the COVID lockdowns started:
The Federal Reserve is prepared to use its full range of tools to support the flow of credit to households and businesses and thereby promote its maximum employment and price stability goals.
In english: We're going to keep printing and lowering rates until jobs are back and inflation is under control. If we print until the sun is blotted out, we'll print in the shade.
BTC is not gold
Gold is a good asset for doomsday-preppers. If society crashes, gold will still have value. How do we know that? Gold has held value throughout multiple historic catastrophes over thousands of years. It had value before and after the Bronze Age Collapse, the Fall of the Western Roman Empire and Gengis Khan being Gengis Khan. Even if you erased humanity and started over, the new humans would still find gold to be economically valuable. When Europeans d̶i̶s̶c̶o̶v̶e̶r̶e̶d̶ c̶o̶n̶q̶u̶e̶r̶e̶d̶ g̶e̶n̶o̶c̶i̶d̶e̶d̶ went to America, they found gold to be an important item over there too. This is about equivalent to finding humans on Alpha-Centauri and learning that they think gold is a good store of value as well. Some people are puzzled at this: we don't even use gold for much! But it has great properties: First, gold is hard to fake and impossible to manufacture. This makes it good to ascertain payment. Second, gold doesnt react to oxygen, so it doesn't rust or tarnish. So it keeps value over time unlike most other materials. Last, gold is pretty. This might sound frivolous, and you may not like it, but jewelry has actual value to humans. It's no coincidence if you look at a list of the wealthiest families, a large number of them trade in luxury goods. To paraphrase Veblen humans have a profound desire to signal social status, for the same reason peacocks have unwieldy tails. Gold is a great way to achieve that. On the other hand, BTC lacks all these attributes. Its value is largely based on common perception of value. There are a few fundamental drivers of demand:
Means of Exchange: if people seriously start using BTC to buy pizzas, then this creates a real demand for the currency to accomplish the short-term exchanges. As we saw previously, I'm not personally sold on this one and it's currently a negligible fraction of overall demand.
Criminal uses: Probably the largest inbuilt advantage of BTC is that it's anonymous, and so a great way to launder money. Hacker gangs use BTC to demand ransom on cryptolocker type attacks because it's a shared way for an honest company to pay and for the criminals to receive money without going to jail.
Apart from these, it's hard to argue that BTC will retain value throughout some sort of economic catastrophe.
BTC is really risky
One last statement from Michael Saylor I take offense to is this:
“We feel pretty confident that Bitcoin is less risky than holding cash, less risky than holding gold,” MicroStrategy CEO said in an interview
"BTC is less risky than holding cash or gold long term" is nonsense. We saw before that BTC is more volatile on face value, and that as long as the Fed isn't run by spider monkeys stacked in a trench coat, the inflation is likely to be within reasonable bounds. But on top of this, BTC has Abrupt downside risks that normal currencies don't. Let's imagine a few:
A critical software vulnerability is found in the BTC codebase, leading to a possible exploitation.
Xi Jinping decides he's had enough of rich people in China hiding their assets from him and bans BTC.
Some form of bank run takes hold for whatever reason. Because BTC wallets are uninsured, unlike regular banks, this compounds into a Black Tuesday style crash.
Blockchain solutions are fundamentally inefficient
Blockchain was a genius idea. I still marvel at the initial white paper which is a great mix of economics and computer science. That said, blockchain solutions make large tradeoffs in design because they assume almost no trust between parties. This leads to intentionally wasteful designs on a massive scale. The main problem is that all transactions have to be validated by expensive computational operations and double checked by multiple parties. This means waste:
BTC was estimated to use as much electricity as Belgium in 2019. It's hard to trace where the BTC mining comes from, but we can assume it has a huge carbon footprint.
A single transactions is necessarily expensive. A single transaction takes as much electricity as 800,000 VISA transactions, or watching 50,000 hours of youtube videos.
There is a large necessary tax on the transaction, since those checking the transaction extract a few BTC from it to be incentivized to do the work of checking it.
Many design problems can be mitigated by various improvements over BTC, but it remains that a simple database always works better than a blockchain if you can trust the parties to the transaction.
[Winner’s Thread #58] Thank you from the bottom of my heart.
I am still in shock, wow. I feel like I’m writing an Oscar’s speech, I just want to thank everyone. So thank you all! I was in the car when I got the notification that I was picked and my heart stopped. This is so unreal. I’ve never felt very lucky but I feel like my life is turning around. I know we could all use this money right now and I feel unbelievably blessed to be in this position. My name is Luci and I’m 21 years old! I was in college for about a year but left because I did not feel like I was where I was supposed to be. I’m working in an office now just trying to make it in this crazy world! My favorite thing in the world is to go to the Great Smoky Mountains. It is my happy place. My boyfriend took me on my first vacation ever there and then every year for the past 3 years and I would love to surprise him with a trip there that I plan and pay for when it’s safe to travel. He saved me from my abusive household and has done so much for me that I want to return the favor. With any money left, I would put some aside to give back to this beautiful community and also put it towards my remaining student loans so I can help my credit and hopefully buy a house one day. Thank you again to everyone! I don’t know that I’ll ever be able to wrap my head around this! EDIT: This has been the craziest 24 hours of my life. I don’t even know how to put into words the gratitude in my heart. I’ve never experienced so much good and generosity in one place. I hope you all receive so much good karma. You are all so amazing and I am so thankful for every single one of you. Thank you, thank you, thank you!!!!! ❤️ Everything listed should result in direct lines of payment to lbaumbe. We ask all users to donate at least $1 USD. The Drawing Thread is also listed for users who want to see the results and confirm the validity of the winner, and Activity Proof is listed for those who would like to confirm that the owner of the account is as presented. Drawing Thread: https://reddit.com/millionairemakers/comments/iw8pvc/draw_58/ Activity Proof: https://imgur.com/a/pehPZst PayPal: https://www.paypal.me/lbaumb Venmo: @Lbaumbe Bitcoin: 1AFPDRcWfthyLG1mTMQmKgiUBtR7ysTUtv Bitcoin Cash: qpjhzlalyyv6n6qkxnp2gk53shpvy8kptsajwrcp5h Ethereum: 0xD493a31aaA7f2785CD2271b79A5b6B70d677aBAa
How long till this happens: Sorry, your credit is bad, we can't give you a house/car/etc loan...,oh ok bye, oh wait did I mention I have XYZ Bitcoins... oh wait, come back, lets talk,
How long till this happens: Sorry, your credit is bad, we can't give you a house/caetc loan...,oh ok bye, oh wait did I mention I have XYZ Bitcoins, in my possession, ... You actually own XYZ Bitcoins? Oh wait, come back, lets talk,... and what number would XYZ be? 20?, 10? 1?
[uncensored-r/Bitcoin] Should I go w/ bit and alt coins over my credit and take a $25000 loan at a 20% interest rate
The following post by Camelintotheoasis is being replicated because the post has been silently greylisted. The original post can be found(in censored form) at this link: np.reddit.com/ Bitcoin/comments/7puea5 The original post's content was as follows:
Since no credit check is required, even borrowers with poor credit can receive a Bitcoin loan, so long as the necessary collateral is provided. Long-term positions remain intact. If you are a long-term Bitcoin holder, then you have probably considered selling all or part of your portfolio to get access to the value locked up within it. Though, you probably also don’t want to close these long ... To remove the credit score form the equation you can apply for an asset-backed loan like the one offered by Nexo. LTV is calculated as the loan amount in USD divided by the value of the collateral in USD, expressed as a percentage. Example: Loan amount: 5,000 USD Value of collateral: 10,000 USD Loan-to-Value = ($5,000/$10,000)*100% = 50.0% Bitcoin backed loan institutions do not care about your credit score. With a Bitcoin collateralized loan, most of the risk is removed since you are putting up more value in terms of Bitcoin than the value you are borriwing in US dollars. If you fail to repay the loan, the loaner will just sell your Bitcoin to recoup their money. Bitcoin owners can lend their coins to bitcoin loan seekers to gain some extra profit. But one should know that there are risks involved – the borrower might never pay back or miss out on payments. That is why bitcoin loan investing is a high-risk, potentially high-return game. It’s easy to start if you already own a peer-to-peer account. With an instant bitcoin loan you do not have to have a credit score (with a credit bureau), nor you need to prove your creditworthiness. With a bitcoin loan, you don't prove your reputation, you build it. Bitcoin lenders have created internal reputation systems that are independent and you create your reputation within the community. Getting a loan in bitcoin is not too difficult. Once you ...
1,02 BITCOIN WIN IN 2 MINUTES ! bitcoin loan (PROOF)
Being on the crypto lending market since 2017, the Biterest team has launched a new platform for crypto-backed loans. On the new Biterest Instant platform, you can open a bitcoin-backed credit ... Bitcoin Loans - What is a Bitcoin Loan and how do you get one? - Duration: 1:44. ... Instant Crypto Credit Lines ETHLend - Crypto Loan - Duration: 9:03. Coin Gyaan 1,410 views. 9:03 . How to ... http://bit.ly/BitSler This short video will show you how i made 1,02 bitcoin within 2 minutes ! primedice bitsler method (proof). You are able to earn Bitcoi... Get your first Bitcoin loan at Btcpop.co. Basic step by step process to get your peer-to-peer loan funded Buying bitcoin with a credit card is increasingly difficult but the way it's set up on Xcoins, you are buying from an individual and it's set up a as a simple one time loan. It works well.You can ...